This Rocks. A vegan protocol for teeth remineralization and a little bit about Weston A. Price, the person! It's really cool!

This is a copy and paste from this forum http://www.vegsoc.org.au/forum_messages.asp?Thread_ID=318&Topic_ID=1&start=25

You can get K2 from a supplement. http://www.veganstore.com/now-vitamin-k2/Page_1/939k.html

Dr. Price's "greatest disappointment", as he put it, was that none of the groups he studied was vegetarian/vegan. Going into his research he was sure he would find that such a diet would lead to ideal dental health.

There are several factors to consider when talking about dental health. First, virtually every group that Price studied had nearly perfect teeth, never brushed or flossed and never went to a dentist. So the take home message is that all this cleaning is totally unnecessary given the right dietary nutrients. Think about that every time you brush your teeth and remember what you are doing is only necessary because your diet is some how deficient in something. (But what you ask?)

Second, most dentists actually know very little about tooth mineralization because they were mostly trained in how to fix problems, not prevent them (there's more money in treatment than prevention). Teeth draw nutrients through two basic pathways. Through the root and through the outer surface. The root is nourished by the blood and the surface is nourished by your saliva. (I bet you never thought of saliva as a nutrient delivery system).

For normal mineralization to occur many things have to fall into proper order. Mineral intake has to be adequate and in the proper ratios. Calcium/phosphorous/magnesium/zinc ratios are important as is total quantity. Fat-soluble vitamins are responsible for mineral transport and delivery so intake of vitamin A, D and K as well as saturated fat are necessary. You see you can eat all the calcium you want and it will never get into your blood without A and D. And it will never get out of your blood and into your bones and teeth without vitamin K2. (Activator X turns out to be K2)

Vitamin K2 in particular can significantly lower bacterial count in your mouth, but it can also change your saliva from phosphorous taking to phosphorous bearing.

So the question is can a vegan diet provide all the right nutrients, in the right forms and in the right amounts? I've often wondered this. Let's do an inventory:

1. Minerals--no problem there, vegan diets can be mineral rich and in the proper ratios.
2. Fat soluble vitamins--this get a little tricky. Beta-carotene is not retinol acetate which is vitamin A. BC is pre-vitamin A and has to be converted to retinol acetate in the liver with saturated fat. The conversion ratio is about 10:1 BC:A and is less efficient than that in children, the eldery and people with certain underlying medical conditions.

Vitamin D is another tricky one. Vitamin D3 is what humans make via the sun along with most other animals. Vitamin D2 is found in limited quantities in the vegetable kingdom. Numerous studies have confirmed that D2 is not nearly as useful as D3. (Now there is a vegan version of D3 see earlier post)

Vitamin K is also tricky. So vitamin K1 is part of chlorophyll and is thus available to vegans. K1 is converted into K2 through two mechanisms: bacteria in the intestines and directly in most cell types. However, in the first case, the conversion is very inefficient so dietary K2 seems to be highly beneficial. K2 is rarely found in the vegetable kingdom and then only in fermented foods (ever try natto?)

3. Saturated fat--This is a bit of a problem as vegan tend to have low-fat intake and seem to prefer polyunsaterated and monounsaturated fats to saturated fats. Although coconut oil has made a lot of penetration into the vegan markets and it's almost entire saturated.

So what's the bottom line?

A properly constituted vegan diet can support proper dental development provided it's mineral rich and in the proper ratios, careful attention is paid to consume enough beta-carotene and saturated fat for vitamin A synthesis, get lots of sun for vitamin D synthesis, and eat plenty of green leafy veggies and keep your intestines fermenting properly for K2.

The modern "foods of commerce" Price documented as devastating people's health was devoid of all these things. In addition, sugar, white flour and polyunsaturated oil consumption interferes with many physiological processes and can drive up the need for minerals to make enzymes and vitamins like A,D and C to deal with the oxidative stress.

So in addition to careful nutrient inclusion, you also have to be careful to avoid empty calories.

A note on dental health "success metrics". Dental health should be considered multi-generationally, not in terms of mere years. So you can't look at your 8 year old and say "a vegan diet is producing good dental health". Instead, you must wait twice. You must wait for your child to reach adulthood and have their wisdom teeth come it without any cavities and no need for braces. If cavities occur or braces are needed, then the child has not received proper nutrition (vegan or not). Then you have to wait until your grandchild reaches adulthood and make the same evaluation. Only then will you know if proper nutrition has been in place the entire time. (Yes your parents bad dietary habits are responsible for your poor dental health)

Fluoride is not a human nutrient. There is no such thing as a fluoride deficiency disease. Fluoride can be used to strengthen tooth enamel, but is not naturally present. It is an artificial, industrial, tooth mineral.

Fluoride is one the most pervasive industrial pollutants and is a well know toxin. It is heavily regulated as a toxin everywhere in the world, except in our water supplies and toothpaste. The only reason anyone thinks fluoride is beneficial is because the US government's nuclear weapons program was producing large amounts of it and it was making people and animals sick down wind. Scientists were pressed into service to "discover" beneficial uses for it so that it's truly horrific dangers could be covered up. This has all been well documented through Freedom of Information Act document releases. When you think positive thoughts about fluoride your are being manipulated. If you don't believe me just spend some time doing research on fluoride toxicity or the history of its development.

Finally, the Weston A. Price foundation is a non-profit organization that receives no funding from any food producing groups. It is funded almost entirely from membership dues. It is dedicated to promoting research that supports the conclusions of Dr. Price as outlined in his book "Nutrition and Physical Degeneration". Everyone, including vegetarians and vegans, should read it as it has much to contribute to everyone's conception of diet and eating. The foundation engages in evidence-based advocacy and does not engage in propaganda.


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bp, i don't think aariel was saying that vegans have a worse dental record than omnis, merely that it is such a new phenomenom that vegan diets have not been adequately researched in their relation to multi-generational dental health.... she also was quite clear that most modern omni diets don't measure up for a perfect dental diet either....

"The modern "foods of commerce" Price documented as devastating people's health was devoid of all these things. In addition, sugar, white flour and polyunsaturated oil consumption interferes with many physiological processes and can drive up the need for minerals to make enzymes and vitamins like A,D and C to deal with the oxidative stress.

So in addition to careful nutrient inclusion, you also have to be careful to avoid empty calories.

A note on dental health "success metrics". Dental health should be considered multi-generationally, not in terms of mere years. So you can't look at your 8 year old and say "a vegan diet is producing good dental health". Instead, you must wait twice. You must wait for your child to reach adulthood and have their wisdom teeth come it without any cavities and no need for braces. If cavities occur or braces are needed, then the child has not received proper nutrition (vegan or not). Then you have to wait until your grandchild reaches adulthood and make the same evaluation. Only then will you know if proper nutrition has been in place the entire time. (Yes your parents bad dietary habits are responsible for your poor dental health)"